Avoid unranked players (elo with a ?)

@Ben8035 said in #10:

For example I got 5 in the last day for ... 5 loss. Not so balanced (although I would agree that statistically 5 games do not mean much )
I checked those five games and I have no idea why you chose to believe you lost them because your opponents were much stronger than the level of their rating. They did not play well at all in those games and the actual reason why you lost those five games was that you played even worse. And all of them still have rating within ~80 points from what they had when playing against you (two of the five have lower rating now, three higher). 80 points may sound like a lot but with provisional ratings like theirs, it's what one gains/loses in one or two games.

@mkubecek said in #11:

I checked those five games and I have no idea why you chose to believe you lost them because your opponents were much stronger than the level of their rating. They did not play well at all in those games and the actual reason why you lost those five games was that you played even worse. And all of them still have rating within ~80 points from what they had when playing against you (two of the five have lower rating now, three higher). 80 points may sound like a lot but with provisional ratings like theirs, it's what one gains/loses in one or two games.

Thanks a lot for checking all that. So much effort is very ... unexpected.

I was giving those five games as example (pinpointing it was not statistically relevant). And my point was more from personal experience on all the games I played against provisional accounts.

Anyways, I will just go back to my initial question on whether it was possible or not to filter those accounts.

Thanks a lot for the answer that ... it is not possible .

@Ender88 said in #5:

1. Provisional is not necessarily new player.
   I make such argument because it seems to me that your point is that is fair to allow new players to stabilise their score.
   Yes it's, and I agree with you on that, but what I was arguing is not all provisional players are new players.
   So if I can pair filtering by score an old player, why can't I pair filtering out provisional old players?

Why should you? They simply did not play for a while. And they are not starting out again with 1500. No, they keep playing with whatever rating they are at. And that "?" mostly effects their rating, not yours. They are most likely the same players they were before.

2. I point out that this inability to filter out provisional users, stand also in not rated games. And there is no rationale or motivation for that.

I don't see any reason why playing rated or unrated would make any difference.

@Ben8035 said in #10:

Not sure to get your point here: I was only talking about games against accounts with "provisional" rating. For example I got 5 in the last day for ... 5 loss. Not so balanced (although I would agree that statistically 5 games do not mean much )

Bottom line: I guess the issue is that my current rating is in the range of the default starting elo.

Actually, no. Your blitz rating is below 1200, which is 300 points below the starting rating of 1500 (which should be the median).

Playing against a 1500 rated opponent, you should score around 15% or the points.

Also having had a short look at your games - not all those opponents were really new, and their rating was already significantly below 1500. They are not cheating or smurfing or whatever.

The reason you lost those games? Because you make bad moves, and usually play way too fast. Look at the evaluation graphs: blunders left and right.

While I give you the point that for new players the chances of playing a cheater is a bit higher (as it takes some time to get them banned), this is not what you experience. In fact, those players' ratings have already adjusted downwards towards your rating - quite a clear indication that someone is neither cheating nor smurfing. Quite the opposite: they have already shown that they are below average (or median or whatever) strength.

Keep in mind that on your level, the variance of play is quite high (in everyone's games), and that your agitation with their rating may very well influence your play negatively.

@nadjarostowa said in #14:

and that your agitation with their rating may very well influence your play negatively.
This is an important point. Entering the game with the mindset that your opponent is likely a cheater and that you are going to lose anyway is a factor that can affect your play in a negative sense so that you really lose. I would suggest to give the zen mode a try: not knowing if you are supposed to win or lose can be quite refreshing and you can relax and focus on the game only and play without a prejudice and negative thoughts (or overconfidence which can be just as harmful).

@Ben8035 said in #6:

It's like a judo beginner who needs to practice with other white belts or slightly more advanced students to learn fundamentals. If they're constantly matched against colored belts pretending to be beginners, they won't learn proper technique - they'll just get thrown repeatedly without understanding why or how to improve. The same applies in chess: meaningful learning requires appropriate, honest opposition.

With way more years in Judo than you (probably) I learned long ago to ignore the belt. I've been tossed by people wearing white and I have thrown 5d and former national champion. Only substance matters. In Judo just an in chess.

@nadjarostowa said in #13:

I don't see any reason why playing rated or unrated would make any difference.
Because rated games affect the score that's the difference.
If score is not affected it's only a casual game, so IMHO user should have more freedom in choosing the opponent

The question at the end is, if I play for fun affecting no statistics to anyone (a game that is not representative of anything) . Why shouldn't I be able to pair with whoever I like, freely?

I think it wouldn't really have any bad side effects (well, maybe for you, as you seem to play unrated almost exclusively, and would be sidelined by many other players then).

But then, excluding and discriminating against random players simply seems the wrong thing to support. So in a way, the system helps you to not make a fool out of yourself.

@Ender88 said in #17:

The question at the end is, if I play for fun affecting no statistics to anyone (a game that is not representative of anything) . Why shouldn't I be able to pair with whoever I like, freely?

You can just send challenge to players you like to play with.

@petri999 said in #19:

You can just send challenge to players you like to play with.
Yes but I can't "broadcast" a request AFAIK, and I would like to do so (for not ranked casual games)